45. Feeling Lonely in a Relationship? (with Jordan Nofziger)

Many of us have experienced “gay loneliness” from growing up gay in a straight society. We can feel isolated from our straight peers and even members of our community. But what happens when we feel that same sense of loneliness in a romantic relationship?

In this episode, my friend, Jordan Nofziger, joins us to discuss overcoming loneliness in a relationship and recognizing our inner strength to make our own happiness.

Transcript

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Snarky Opener (0:00)

Rob Loveless

What do you do to prevent yourself from feeling hopeless or lonely?

Jordan Nofziger

Oh, God.

Rob Loveless

Real light question there.

Episode Introduction (0:27)

Rob Loveless

Hello, my LGBTQuties, and welcome back to another episode of A Jaded Gay.

I'm Rob Loveless and, today, I'm a non-jaded gay because I've just been feeling really inspired with my writing lately.

I've just been getting more done, writing a few more chapters, excited about the story ahead. It doesn't feel like an effort to put it together. It's kind of just flowing out, which is great.

That's not supposed to be dirty. So, yeah, just feeling inspired.

Gay Loneliness (0:49)

Rob Loveless

Anyway, you know, in past episodes, we've touched upon gay men feeling lonely from growing up gay in a straight world.

You know, the lack of representation in the media, not having gay role models growing up. I think it left a lot of us feeling like we're an other.

And I think sometimes we turn to dating to deal with some of that loneliness, and if we date the wrong people, that can only make us feel lonelier.

So today, I'm excited because my friend, Jordan, is joining us to talk about feeling lonely in a relationship. 

But before we get into that funness, you know the drill, let's pull our tarot card.

Tarot (1:20)

Rob Loveless

So, the card for this episode is Strength, which is a Major Arcana card. It's number eight in numerology, which represents progress, making decisive action.

In astrology, it's tied to Leo, which is all about courage and being heart-centered. And when we pull this card, it's indicating that we're overcoming obstacles and we're enduring through hardship.

Basically, it's pretty straightforward. We're stronger than we know.

You know, life's full of challenges, but when we get this card, it's indicating we need to trust ourselves, that we have what we need to get forward, to move through a tough situation, whatever it may be.

And when it comes to a relationship, this can indicate not being afraid to be vulnerable, which I know is a hard thing.

We've covered it a lot in episodes like, you know, attachment styles, just most recently, about emotional unavailability, all that fun stuff.

But we really need to trust ourselves and be courageous enough to be vulnerable. Because if we share our heart with our partner, then it'll help us overcome obstacles that may come up in a relationship.

Or on the flip side, if we're not happy in a relationship, I think that this card is an indicator that we can survive on our own. You know, it might be tough to make the decision to end things, but we're strong. 

We have what we need to take care of ourselves. And basically, whenever we pull this card, we need to be fueled by our inner strength, our personal power, and ultimately, our intuition.

You know, we need to trust ourselves, trust our feelings. Not act emotionally, but just really kind of take the emotions into consideration, think through, and act logically.

And through doing that, we'll get the confidence we need to overcome any obstacles, any growing fears or challenges, and know that no matter what action we take, we're on the right path forward.

So that being said, let's keep that Strength in mind as we talk about feeling lonely.

Guest Introduction (2:46)

Rob Loveless

Make way. We've got a doctor in the house. I am pleased to introduce my friend Jordan.

Jordan Nofziger

Hi everybody.

Rob Loveless

So, do you just want to introduce yourself? How you identify, pronouns, all that fun stuff?

Jordan Nofziger

Sure, I'm Jordan Nofziger. I am gay, and my pronouns are he/him.

Rob Loveless

Awesome. And you're also a doctor?

Jordan Nofziger

Yes, I am. I recently defended my doctorate back in November. I am a Doctor of Education.

Rob Loveless

Congrats. And just to kick it off, I like to ask all my guests, are you a jaded or non-jaded gay today?

Jordan Nofziger

Today, I am a non-jaded gay. Just in a good mood today.

Gay Men & Loneliness (3:17)

Rob Loveless

So, to kick things off, let's talk about loneliness and just where you're currently at in life.

Do you feel lonely, you know, in terms of either just relationships, being a gay man in society? Just, you know, base level, where are you at?

Jordan Nofziger

I think there are times when everybody feels some lonely, some loneliness, but right now, I don't feel lonely.

Rob Loveless

And do you think that's something, you know, a sense of confidence you've achieved as you've gone on in life?

Do you think when you were younger, you know, first coming out, you felt, you know, more lonely, and it's just something you've kind of been able to overcome?

Jordan Nofziger

For me, I think it comes from lived experience. Early in my probably 20s, I was in a long-term relationship.

You know, I'd never really had the opportunity to be my, by myself. I, you know, lived at home until I was 18. I went to college, and in college is where I actually met one of my exes.

We were together for about five and a half years, and so I'd never really had the opportunity to be alone. 

And so, after breaking up and really having time for myself, I think is where I really learned to be happy with myself.

I don't think we need people to make us happy, and so learning to just be happy on your own, I think is important.

Rob Loveless

And I'm sorry you said that was earlier, like when you, around the time you came out, you had that relationship?

Jordan Nofziger

It was around the time I came out to my family. My friends had known for probably five or six years by that point, but it was in my early 20s.

Rob Loveless

Well before we get into the relationship piece, let's talk about, you know, loneliness. Do you think? And I know you said, you know, getting good with yourself as you go on.

Do you think that there is an additional layer for gay men, just growing up gay in a straight world that adds a layer of loneliness beyond, you know, being single or whatever?

Or do you think it's kind of just base-level for everyone?

Jordan Nofziger

I think it's different for everybody. For me personally, growing up, I knew there was something that was quote-unquote different.

So, I think just that alone kind of adds to feelings of isolation. You know, I had family, I had friends around, but there's still something that you kind of feel is a little off in your life.

And trying to figure out what that is, I think can lead to some loneliness.

Rob Loveless

Definitely because I think, you know, for myself too, I definitely felt different too. And I know some people say from an early age they realized they were gay.

That wasn't the case for me, but there is a sense of feeling different than everyone else.

Like the way, I can only describe it is, you know, growing up all my friends and family, I just felt everybody was like so much cooler. And maybe it was just that they were more secure in themselves versus me.

But I felt, you know, I had my friends who were good at school and good at sports or, you know, good with relationships.

And then I felt like I was just this frumpy kind of other, and felt like, you know, the odd man out, and that was without realizing my sexuality. That definitely caused some loneliness.

Then when you realize, you know, there's something additionally different about you that you've been told is not good, or bad, that can even create more loneliness.

So, I think that's a really, I don't know if that's something similar you felt.

Jordan Nofziger

At times, yeah. I mean, growing up, especially in a very small town, you know, kind of what you know is what you see on television growing up.

And so, you know, you see people that are living these exciting lifestyles. And here I am in small town in Northwest Ohio, and the most exciting thing to do is go to the next town and go to Walmart.

So, growing up and seeing people that are kind of living more extravagant lifestyles, or they're more sure in who they are, or they excel at something that you don't, can kind of add to feelings of isolation and loneliness on top of, you know, just trying to figure out who you are.

Rob Loveless

And kind of taking that to the next level, can you walk me through your coming out process?

You know, in terms of one I guess, I guess it's kind of threefold: coming out to yourself, coming out to your friends, and then coming out to your family a few years later, who, and I think you said around that time, is when you have that relationship as well.

Jordan Nofziger 

For me personally, I had always kind of known that I was gay. I don't know that I knew the term for it, or really what it meant when I was younger.

But I remember probably around the age of nine or ten being attracted to guys.

But I knew enough living in a small town, and, you know, this was the early, early to mid-90s, at that point, to just kind of keep my mouth shut and not say anything about it because I knew it wasn't the norm.

But coming out to my friends, I think, was a pretty easy process. You know, nobody was surprised when I told them, but I felt comfortable enough with them to know that they wouldn't turn their back on me. 

So, coming out to my friends was a pretty easy process. With my parents, I didn't actually tell them. They asked. I was in my I guess my last year of college.

It was actually my junior year, ended up being my senior year. I finished early.

But at the time, I was still planning on coming back for for another year, and I wanted to live off campus with a friend of mine and the guy who was my boyfriend.

And so, I had sent an email to my parents, kind of trying to start that conversation of potentially living off campus, and, you know, this was a new person they'd never heard of before, and they flat out asked me, is, is this person a friend, or is he more than a friend?

And so that kind of prompted me to just, you know, open up to them and tell them the truth. And it was a little rocky at the beginning.

You know, I I grew up going to church, and, you know, my parents are somewhat religious. I feel like not as much now as when I was younger, but it was a little rocky when I first told them that I was gay.

I wasn't quite sure how they would take it when I did eventually tell them. I wasn't ready, I kind of felt almost forced out of the closet. But I don't think they were surprised by it either.

Rob Loveless

It's really interesting that you say that. There's a lot I want to break into there, but one just recently said, you know, you feel like you weren't really ready. You were kind of forced out.

And I don't know if anyone's ever really ready. I definitely feel the same way. I was not ready, and I felt like, you know, I came out because of a situation I was in.

I was, I thought I was dating somebody. I wasn't really, but I was like, oh, well, I want to be open about this, so that way it's not like a double whammy.

Like, here I'm gay and then I'm also dating this person. And then that person went away because, again, it wasn't dating or anything.

I was just kind of, like living like that middle school crush, but as a 21-year-old gay man. You know, like when you're in middle school and you think, like, oh, my God, I love this person. They're going to marry me.

And obviously, I think a lot of people get to experience that when they are in middle school and grow out of it.

But for me, that came when I was 21 dating somebody who was a year younger than me at the time. You know, like, that was ever really going to work out, especially because I was about to move.

But then that person went away, and I felt, you know, very alone, like, oh, I wasn't ready to come out. But now you were dating somebody at that time, so at least that, I don't.

I hope this doesn't sound that, but did it feel like you had somebody to, like, fall on during that time that you came out?

So, you didn't feel as alone or isolated coming out to your family?

Jordan Nofziger

God, it's been so long now that I don't really, I don't really remember how I felt.

But I mean that relationship at that point, I think was probably still pretty new, but I did have friends in college at least that I knew that I could lean on and turn to.

I'm sure I felt that way about my boyfriend at the time, but it's been so long that I really can't remember.

Relationship Loneliness (10:21)

Rob Loveless

Shifting it from, you know, coming out and just the kind of, I don't know if disconnect's the right word, but the disconnect between being, you know, gay in a straight world, which can cause some loneliness. 

In that relationship, you said was that? Did it last five years did you say?

Jordan Nofziger

Yeah, about five and a half.

Rob Loveless

Okay. And then I think you had a pretty another, another long-term relationship after that, correct?

Jordan Nofziger

I did. That one lasted about two years.

Rob Loveless

Okay. In either of those relationships, and I'm asking is, because I don't, I don't have the experience, but I know, you know, I think when you're with somebody longer term, you get a little comfortable with them. 

And you know, I had talked about this in the episode with Sara, or, I guess I should say she had talked about this. People kind of grow away without realizing it sometimes.

So within either of those relationships, did you ever feel any sense of loneliness?

Jordan Nofziger

I did with the longer one, the one that lasted five and a half years.

And I think part of it was probably growing apart a little bit, but I think most of it came from him kind of unintentionally pushing me away with his actions.

We were together for five and a half years, and that was probably about five years too long. He was not a very good person, and I had multiple people tell me that, and I didn't listen.

And I think it's one of those cases where you have to just kind of let things play out and realize that for yourself.

I think if you really try and take people's word, I think you're going to end up resenting people for that. But in this situation, he was not a very nice person. He was kind of toxic in a lot of ways.

If I did something wrong or I did something that he didn't like, he was very sure to let me know that. He made me feel very insecure and oftentimes like I wasn't enough.

But at the time, I didn't really realize that. You know, I can look back on things now and realize how incompatible we were from the start.

But I think as, you know, a 20 or 21-year-old, you don't realize that. You, you know, you have that kind of sexual attraction that you want to play into and figure out.

And I think that was, that was really the basis of our relationship in the beginning was that physical and sexual attraction.

But as time went on, I just, I realized more and more that he wasn't a good person for me. But for me personally, and just the dynamic in our relationship, he often made me feel like I wasn't enough.

And that kind of made me wonder, well, if I end this, who's gonna want me? Because I felt like he was the only person that would be interested in me.

And so, I really stuck it out for a long time because he had kind of worn down my self-worth, and I didn't really feel like I had any other options.

Rob Loveless

Can you walk through, is there a specific situation or scenario that's really vivid in your mind of kind of talking about that dynamic of him making you not feel enough?

Jordan Nofziger

I mean, there were many times where, you know, I would say something or do something, or I would try and be funny, and it would kind of fall flat, and he would just really make me feel stupid and inadequate. 

And that kind of just, it really challenged everything that I thought about myself up to that point. So, it was just a really difficult relationship to be in for, you know, for so long.

It really kind of wears down on you mentally and puts you in a place where you start to pull away, but he's always there. You know, it was very rare that we did anything on our own.

You know, anything we did, we did together. My friends were his friends, his friends were my friends. So anytime we hung out with somebody, it was together.

And I didn't have kind of a time to pull away and reflect and really kind of think about what our relationship was, which in itself, is really unhealthy to just spend that much time with somebody.

Rob Loveless

And going back to what you said about being afraid of, like, if I'm not with this person, then who else will want me? And you know, I love a Kylie Minogue reference.

It's kind of like it's better the devil you know where it's, like, this situation doesn't feel good to me, and I don't think I want to be in this, but it's, at least, this is familiar to me, whereas it's scary if I go out there because then it does lead me to ask the question, who would want me then?

And I have to kind of navigate that piece.

Jordan Nofziger

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, at that point, I had never been alone, so I didn't really know how to function without somebody else there with me, whether it was my parents or friends.

Or in this case, my boyfriend. So just that aspect of it alone was really frightening to me. You know, I was in my first full-time job out of college, and in a lot of ways, I felt dependent on him.

In a lot of ways, I think he felt dependent on me. And so, it was just really not a good place to be at that point in my life. I don't think it's a good place for anybody to be at any point in their life.

Rob Loveless

It's interesting too, because I feel like what you're describing that time in your life, I can kind of relate to that.

I think because, you know, when I, like when you came out to your parents, I think it was around the same, a similar time. I was the same age when I came out to my parents.

It was like my final semester of college, I just started dating, you know, I just started kind of accepting that I was gay and, you know, going on the dating apps.

And I was hanging out with this guy for a bit who, you know, I thought, like, oh, it seems like he likes me. Like we're gonna end up together. Like I said, that kind of, you know, fantasy, whatever.

Um, and then that didn't work out. And then on top of that, I graduated college, I moved to another state and started a new job, where I didn't know anybody other than, you know, I had extended family in the area, but, like, you can't go out.

I mean, you could, but I wouldn't go out to the bar with my grandmother as my social life, you know? So, I didn't really know anybody.

And it seems like, from what you're saying, it sounds like it was kind of a similar time in your life where, like, you know, you came out to your parents, you started your full-time job.

It's kind of this crazy time where, like, I'm no longer a student. I'm beginning a new identity as, like, a full-time worker. This is a different change in my life from this.

I've also just come out to my parents, which is, you know, really me being open with them, which is scary. And then this, this relationship drama is happening on top of that.

Jordan Nofziger

For me, I really didn't have anybody but him.

You know, after I graduated college, you know, everybody that I went to high school with was four and a half hours away, and then everybody that I went to college with was kind of moving out of the area.

I was a theater major, and so a lot of people that I knew were moving to New York or LA or Chicago, and I kind of was here.

And so, I didn't have really any friends to turn to and kind of talk about how it was feeling, or, you know, to get the strength from them to make a decision that I probably needed to make years sooner than I actually did.

So, it's, it's really important to have that kind of network of people in your life that you can turn to when you're in a bad situation, regardless of what that situation is.

But in this one in particular, I just didn't really have anyone that I felt like I could turn to, and so I stayed in a bad situation much longer than I should have.

Rob Loveless

And can you walk us through that timeline? A little bit of, you know, came out to your parents because you're moving in with a friend, and then this guy.

About six months into that relationship, you said, like, things started showing up that they weren't great, and then it lasted another five years.

So, can you walk us through, like, kind of the digression of that relationship and when it eventually ended?

Jordan Nofziger

We probably started dating in the fall of what was originally my junior year of college.

He had just transferred and lived on the same floor as my friend, and I remember sitting in the cafeteria with my friend. He didn't know anybody else in there but her, and so he asked to join us.

So that's how we met. We met through this friend in the cafeteria at school.

And right from the beginning, it was kind of really hot and heavy. I had a single dorm room, so I lived by myself in the dorms. And right from the beginning, he was staying with me almost every night.

And then I graduated at the end of that year, and we got our first place together, and probably at least through that point to when we first moved in together, things were fine.

But then shortly after that, we were spending so much time together because, you know, I just graduated, so I didn't have money, and he was still in school and he didn't have money, and so there wasn't really anything for us to do, but kind of sit at home.

And just spending so much time together is so unhealthy, from my perspective. At least that early in a relationship. You know, we hadn't even been together for a year yet, and we were living together.

We'd been living together almost from the beginning.

But there wasn't really a kind of division of responsibility at all. I felt like I was doing everything: I cooked, I cleaned, I did the laundry, I went and got groceries.

So even from the beginning, I felt like I was kind of doing everything. I didn't really have any support, even from him.

And then anytime where I might do something that he thought was stupid or wrong, he made sure that I knew that, and that was pretty constant through most of our relationship, probably at least by a year in. 

So, you know, I felt like he was the kind of person that had to control everything. He wanted me to feel dependent on him, which I did, even though I was kind of basically functioning alone.

He wasn't really that supportive of a person. But he somehow still made me feel like I needed him.

And that was an awful place to be because that's what led to my feelings of, well, if I end this, who will want to be with me? So that was a really terrible place to be and to be in that mindset for so long.

It's really isolating because he wasn't, he wasn't a supportive person. He wasn't there in my corner, but I felt like I needed him, but I wasn't getting the things that I needed out of the relationship.

And so, it was very lonely and isolating to be in that position for so long. But probably by the time I was 25, maybe close to 26, is kind of, I'd finally reached my breaking point.

I'd realized that what everybody had been saying all along, that he is not a good person, he's rude, he's, you know, you can do better than that, I finally started to realize, you know, they're right.

You know, I'd been unhappy for so long, and I finally had kind of reached my my breaking point and decided to end it.

And even after that period where I ended it, I remember thinking many times, did I make a mistake? Should I take him back? Because I know he'll come back.

And a big part of that is finding the strength to stick with your decision. And if you have people that can support you through that, that's even better.

I didn't really have that because, you know, we did everything together. All of our friends were mutual friends, and so I didn't really have anybody that I could turn to and talk about how I was feeling.

But I think if you're able to, to have that support, whether it's in your parents or friends or, you know, you have a therapist that you can talk to and help you work through those issues.

I had to get to that point on my own. So, you know, the whole early part of my 20s was taken up by this horrible relationship.

Rob Loveless

And that's a significant time too, you know, for any relationship, good or bad. So, when it ended, you know, how did you feel?

And especially since you had talked about, you know, feeling like, if I'm not with him, who would want me, then, how, how did you feel, and how did you cope with that afterwards?

Jordan Nofziger

I remember feeling, shortly after breaking up with him, that I had made a mistake. And I remember thinking multiple times, should I take him back?

Because I actually felt more lonely in the wake of that relationship ending than I did when I was with him. And so that really had me second-guessing the decision that I made.

But I just kept thinking back on how unhappy I was with him, and kind of starting to realize my own self-worth, and realizing that it's not worth it to go back to him.

You know, I'm, I'm more lonely now, but it will pass. You know, I'll make friends, I'll meet somebody else. And that kind of gave me something to look forward to.

Rob Loveless

And I really like how you phrase, you know, I know I feel lonely now, but that will go away. So how did you get to that point where you didn't feel lonely anymore post-breakup?

Jordan Nofziger

At that point, I was going into grad school to start my master's program. And so, it gave me something to focus on. You know, I had my job and I had school to focus on.

And, you know, I started to make some friends of my own. And so that kind of gave me the strength to keep moving forward.

And it had, you know, being in school gave me something to distract myself with.

So, for me, it was just having something to kind of keep my mind occupied, so that I wasn't sitting there thinking about being lonely, or, you know, I made a mistake, or I miss him, when, really, I didn't miss him at all.

Loneliness from Dating Apps (23:25)

Rob Loveless

And then, when did you, how long after that did you start dating?

Like, when did you feel that you were in a place where you'd start, you know, dipping your toes in the dating pool again?

Jordan Nofziger

I want to say probably about a year, maybe a little less. It kind of, before I kind of felt like I could kind of put myself back out there.

I was kind of, you know, obviously, I was burned by that relationship, and so it wasn't something that I really wanted to jump right into. It was my first time living alone.

I kind of wanted to, you know, settle in on my own. So, I didn't rush into it. It was probably about a year.

Rob Loveless

And how did you go about dating when that time came up? Because I know you said you met, you know, the ex you had talked about before in school.

Had you switched gears to, you know, using dating apps at that point?

Jordan Nofziger

Yeah, most of those apps were still kind of in their infancy at that time.

But, you know, I've never really been a bar person, so that wasn't really an option for me to meet people. So, unfortunately, it was the apps.

Rob Loveless

And I was asking because I think dating apps. And I'm going to use the term dating in quotations because I feel a lot of those dating apps are not actually used for dating.

You know, when I first started putting myself out there, I downloaded Grindr because that was the one app I had heard people talk about, and I thought it was the gay eHarmony, and I was quickly realized I was mistaken there.

But I think because of that too, just, the dynamics of, for me anyway, looking at the dating apps, the dynamics of how people are treating you on there, you know, you might message somebody, never hear back.

And it might not be an actual rejection of you, but it feels like a micro rejection, in a way.

And then, you know, just seeing other people who maybe you feel look better than you or are in better shape or this or that or it can just make me feel lonelier sometimes when I've been on the apps in the past.

So, you know, when you were getting to that place of getting back into the dating pool, you know, and then going on the apps for the first time, did that add to your feelings of loneliness, or did you not really experience that at all?

Jordan Nofziger

I don't remember feeling that way. I'm not the most outgoing person, so it's very rare that I'm the one that kind of, you know, makes the first move and sends the first message.

So typically, I only really talked to people if they messaged me first, but I also didn't try and push anything in terms of meeting people.

So, I think a lot of those conversations just kind of fizzled out on their own. I don't remember them being such a huge presence like they are.

Now for most people, you know, this was probably like 2000 it was probably like 10 or 11 years ago that that relationship ended at this point, and so, you know, Grindr, and I'm not even sure if Scruff even existed yet.

Those apps were still pretty new, so I don't think they really kind of owned people's lives in the same way that they do today.

So, I don't remember them really contributing to my feeling lonely at all at that point in time.

Rob Loveless

And I think that's interesting, because, you know, for me, when I first started, you know, coming out and stuff Tinder, not just gay, but like, I mean, for everybody, gay and straight, Tinder was just coming out, and that was, like, it's kind of like the new, like, hot or not so to speak.

People were getting on there to see if people are interested in them. And I think what you bring up is a good point that I think especially within the gay community, we are very app-focused now.

You know, I haven't gotten into an episode in this yet, but I know there's been a lot of articles out there about how the gay bar scene is dying because people aren't using gay bars as a way to meet their community anymore when everybody can be on a geo location-based app.

So, I, and I, I felt, personally, when I've been on the apps in the past, that if I wasn't on a dating app, then I wasn't dating.

Like I wasn't going to be able to find somebody because, you know, I'm also not a bar person, and I'm just, I, I'm not somebody to really, I'm a little shy.

So, I'm not somebody to just kind of approach somebody and be like, hey, are you gay? Want to date? 

Like, so, I guess, you know, as you've gone on throughout the years, using apps, you know, being maybe on and off of them, has that kind of impacted your view of dating at all?

Jordan Nofziger

It has a little bit because, you know, up until that point in time, if you met somebody, you kind of met them by chance, in person. So, it has kind of shifted the way that I think about dating.

But I think I'm old enough and wise enough now that I don't put that much stock into dating apps. So, if I'm talking to somebody and they suddenly block me, I'm like whatever.

You know, it wasn't meant to be, apparently. So, you know, there's somebody else out there.

I don't put much faith into those apps because, you know, like you kind of alluded to earlier, most people that are on those apps are really looking for one thing.

And I'm seeing more and more people in open relationships on those kinds of apps, which I'm not interested in at all. And so those are people that I just kind of immediately write off.

I'll talk to you if you message me, but you know, it's never going to be anything more than chat, maybe friends.

So, there are a lot of people that I can kind of immediately write off when I'm on those kinds of apps.

And being in the relationships that I've been in, and just having the experiences that I've had, I have a pretty clear picture of what it is that I want from somebody, and it's nothing crazy just, you know, people having, like, a full-time job, they live on their own, they believe in monogamy.

You know, things like that are important to me. So, you can usually tell within the first, you know, five minutes of chatting with somebody if they're going to be, you know, a potential match or not.

So, I really don't put much stock into those kinds of apps because more often than not, people aren't really on there looking for the same thing that I'm looking for.

Rob Loveless

You know, going back to the things that you are looking for, I feel like for myself, you know, that's something else. I want, monogamy, you know, ideally, a full-time job would be great.

I also, out of a relationship, I definitely, you know, want to get married and have kids someday, which seems very much like, sometimes an outlier. At least, especially in the app culture.

You're really not seeing that much out there. I don't have numbers or stats.

I don't know what the actual percentage is of gay men who want to get married in a monogamous marriage, and, you know, have kids, but it really doesn't seem like that's something that's seen out there on the dating apps, which, again, is what I primarily used to date in the past.

And that's where I've definitely felt like an other within a community that's already made to feel like an other and added to my feelings of loneliness.

So, knowing you know the things that you are looking for, when you don't find that in a person, or if you're, you know, being presented with all these potential suitors who don't encapsulate any of that, what do you do to prevent yourself from feeling hopeless or lonely?

Jordan Nofziger

Oh, God.

Rob Loveless

Real light question there.

Jordan Nofziger

Because I don't put that much stock into dating, I invest my emotions elsewhere.

I have really great friends and family, so, you know, I let them kind of fill the voids, the things that I'm not getting out of a relationship for the most part. I mean, they can't take care of everything, but for me, that's where I kind of focus my energy, is building those relationships.

And if something is going to happen romantically with somebody, then that'll happen somehow. I'm not, you know, not shut off to it, and I'm still putting myself out there. I'm on dating apps.

I'm on Tinder and Bumble and, you know, whatever. So those opportunities are still there, but I'm not in a hurry to find them.

Episode Closing (31:06)

Rob Loveless

You know, we've definitely covered a lot, so I think just kind of trying to lead more towards a more uplifting note, talking about that situation you had been in with your ex, feeling, like, lonely.

You weren't getting what you needed in a relationship, but the fear of leaving and being like, you know, who would want me then if he doesn't?

What advice would you give to someone who's currently struggling with loneliness in a relationship, whether it's a situation similar to that, or maybe they're just dating somebody who's emotionally unavailable, who's being distant?

What, what advice would you give?

Jordan Nofziger

There are so many reasons somebody could be lonely in a relationship.

If somebody's in a situation similar to mine, I would say, really build up the network of people around you that you can turn to and pull strength from.

You know, hopefully, you're not in kind of that situation that I was in where you're so dependent on one another that, you know, you share the same friends and don't really have anybody of your own.

But if you have people that you can turn to, I think that is really a key in that situation.

They can really help you and guide you through that and be your emotional support and kind of be there to support you so that you don't go running back into that mistake, and really help you stick with the decision that you've made.

So, I think that's a really big key, is having people in your corner that you can turn to to really pull that strength from and help you keep it.

Rob Loveless

And I think it's really easy to connect to the tarot today. You know, Strength is pretty straightforward there through talking about this.

You know, whether we're feeling lonely being an other in society or lonely because we're single or lonely in a relationship. I think it's really just a reminder that we need to be enough for ourselves.

And you know that can feel lonely and isolating at moments, but in the long run, we need to know that we have what it takes to make sure we're okay.

We can take care of ourselves. We we have what we need to keep ourselves alive.

You know, even if other people are hurting our feelings or something, it'll suck in that moment if we have to make that decision to break away or whatever. It's going to hurt, but we can survive it ourselves. 

We're strong enough to do that, and we need to have confidence in in the decisions we make, ultimately, knowing that it'll lead us to a better tomorrow.

Because, like you said, it was better to feel lonely post-breakup, knowing that that loneliness would go away some time, as opposed to just kind of staying in that relationship and just keeping that dynamic and feeling it over and over.

So, you know, with that being said, do you have any closing thoughts or final words for anyone?

Jordan Nofziger

This is going to sound really cheesy or corny, but, you know, everything you need you have within yourself.

And it took me a really long time to realize that, and that's kind of what ended up giving me the strength to end that relationship that I was so unhappy in is to realize that everything I need, I can provide for myself.

I was already doing it, but I was kind of keeping this other part of my life that was really just dragging me down.

And so, realizing that once I could end that part of my life that was making me so unhappy that, you know, I can put more time and energy into myself and make myself happier than this other person ever could.

Connect with A Jaded Gay (34:08)

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I think it's really great note to wrap up on. So, thank you, Jordan, for joining us today. Hope everybody found this uplifting.

As a reminder, if you have any questions or feedback, you can reach out to me rob@ajadedgay.com. Please remember to rate, review, and subscribe.

You can also follow the podcast on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, and SoundCloud @ajadedgaypod. You can also support the show on Patreon for as little as $1 a month.

And as always, every day is all we have, so you got to make your own happiness.

Jordan Nofziger

Mmm-bye.

Outtake (34:58)

Rob Loveless

In addition to Tinder and Bumble, I'm also adding his social profile into the show notes so you can slide into his DMs after listening to this. Um.